Major YB stream renovation proposed from the town up through Allenberry

[afishinado]

Fly fishing is one of the most popular attractions offered at Allenberry Resort. And new owner Mike Kennedy is planning to cater to that audience as renovations continue.

"We're working with a guy who does stream restorations from the State College area," he said. "He's going to submit to do major stream renovation from the town up through the resort."

If approved, the plan will remove nearly 100 years of silt deposits from the creek, making the stream deeper and thus a better environment for fish.

"Parts of that creek have gotten really shallow with the silt," he said. "It takes permits and a significant amount of construction, but we're committed to doing it as soon as the permits will allow."

Those permits, according to Kennedy, aren't likely to allow for any work on the creek bed before August.

In the meantime, however, fishermen are welcome to fish in the Yellow Breeches immediately on the opposite shore.

"We own 13 acres on the other side of the creek," Kennedy said. "We've made that available to the public for fishing form that side."

The idea is to avoid congestion and confusion on the resort itself.

"Before, what they did was they had fishermen parking all over the resort property," Kennedy said. "And we just can't have that. Rather than the fisherman who are just there to hit the creek trying to vie for parking, we said we have this space on the other side. Use it enjoy it. Then we can attend to the guests as well."

Once the resort is fully operational, guests can still enter the creek from the resort side.

"If you're a master fly gisherman, you go in the creek and do your thing," Kennedy said. "We want to engage the people who are maybe first time fly fisherman or fisherwoman, and really learn the sport and enjoy it to the point where, when they leave, they know a whole lot more about than when they came, and two, they're most likely catching fish.

To that end, the resort is partnering with TCO Fly Shop in Boiling Springs to offer classes and lessons.

"They have guys that are going to be working with us to set up fly fishing schools and groups and afternoons with individuals," Kennedy said. "We're going to be really promoting the fishing on the creek there."

Full article here. http://www.pennlive.com/life/2017/04/allenberry_fishing_yellow_bree.html

 

[geebee]

I thought Allenberry was downstream below the town no ?

 

[nomad_archer]

I do believe allenberry is downstream of town. Once you get below allenberry I thought I saw some posted signs on the stream although I could be wrong on the posted signage. I was cold and not catching fish that day so I didn't get close enough to fully read the sign.

 

[troutbert]

Is he talking about removing the sediments above the dam, but leaving the dam in place?

If so, the sediments will accumulate behind the dam again of course. But how quickly they will accumulate is a good question.

I think it's likely to happen pretty quickly. Maybe sediment accumulations would be nearly back where they were in about 10 years or so? Does anyone have any info or experience on this?

 

[CVangler]

Just talked to a local "bigshot" and he agreed with me that Allenberry will close the stream and reserve it for guests. Do you really think they're going to let anyone fish with skeet/trap shooting taking place? He also said he believes TCO will be partnering with Allenberry to be their private guide service for the creek.

 

[geebee]

CVangler wrote:
Just talked to a local "bigshot" and he agreed with me that Allenberry will close the stream and reserve it for guests. Do you really think they're going to let anyone fish with skeet/trap shooting taking place? He also said he believes TCO will be partnering with Allenberry to be their private guide service for the creek.

that's possible. I think its more like they'll close their side of the property. the other side will be open.

I'd also guess that above the dam they will stock outsize pellet pigs like the resorts do in VA and TN.

 

[joebamboo]

I tend to agree with CV. in that eventually the flyfishing only stretch will become private. geebee they own the property on both sides, why would they not close all of it?

I truly and sadly foresee the end of public access to this part of the stream.

 

[HopBack]

I tend to agree with CV. in that eventually the flyfishing only stretch will become private.

I didn't know there was a fly fishing only section on the breeches????

 

[geebee]

joebamboo wrote:
I tend to agree with CV. in that eventually the flyfishing only stretch will become private. geebee they own the property on both sides, why would they not close all of it?

hopefully to maintain some goodwill with the Town and the PFBC ?

 

[Dave_W]

HopBack wrote:
I didn't know there was a fly fishing only section on the breeches????

It's artificial lures with catch and release.

 

[Dave_W]

At this time, this is all speculation.

What we know now for certain is that public access remains - you still cannot park on the Allenberry property and must instead park up at The Run and walk down. You can still fish Allenberry, they just ask that you keep off the north bank as there is still construction going on.

While we do not yet know the details of any future public fishing access, rumors about private clubs and pellet heads are not useful.

 

[krayfish2]

I'd be interested to see what they could do between the run and the dam. That section surely wouldn't hurt from some improvements / TLC.

 

[laurelrun]

Dave,
Well said. Furthermore, those rumors are directly contrary to the actions of the new owners thus far. Let's not assume the worst in people when they continue to be acting as good partners.

 

[nomad_archer]

krayfish2 wrote:
I'd be interested to see what they could do between the run and the dam. That section surely wouldn't hurt from some improvements / TLC.

I too am interested. The water in that stretch is very bland with no real structure to talk about.

 

[troutbert]

krayfish2 wrote:
I'd be interested to see what they could do between the run and the dam. That section surely wouldn't hurt from some improvements / TLC.

What types of improvements would people like to see here?

 

[joebamboo]

Correction, artificial catch and release area. From the run downstream just below Allenberry.

 

[krayfish2]

TB,
How about cover, structure or whatever that might provide lies and feeding lanes. It's basically a mud filled ditch. I remember back in the 80's some nice holding water just below the junction. Last time I was there, it didn't look remotely close to being the same.

 

[Maurice]

"We're working with a guy who does stream restorations from the State College area," he said. "He's going to submit to do major stream renovation from the town up through the resort."

If approved, the plan will remove nearly 100 years of silt deposits from the creek, making the stream deeper and thus a better environment for fish.

"Parts of that creek have gotten really shallow with the silt," he said. "It takes perm its and a significant amount of construction, but we're committed to doing it as soon as the permits will allow."

Those permits, according to Kennedy, aren't likely to allow for any work on the creek bed before August.

The first and last paragraphs sound naive from the reality in PA.

If his "guy" submits a plan and is approved by the permitee(allenberry) first begins the funding process which based on the scope; silt removal(dam removal and disposal of 100 years of hot legacy sediment, in addition to ACOE approvals) , making it deeper,(narrowing of the channel with fish habitat structures and cross stream grade control structures) I would ballpark the restoration in the 6-800k range. Is the owner can't finance the "guy" will have to secure funding from a non profit source.

Once they begin the permit process it ain't happening even remotely close to august. And with work restrictions for wild trout(October 1-December 31) and stocked trout streams (March 1-June 15) that leaves them next winter and next summer as the earliest. (Without waivers)

Based on stream size there will be considerable sediment releases with any cross stream structures so waivers are unlikely.

"Making it deeper" can only mean narrowing with grade control structures that focus fluvial energy to create plunge pools. Every foot of man made grade change eliminates a natural riffle grade change where the macro communities thrive.

Narrowing can also mean bank tied habitat structures which also focus energy to scour channel thalwegs.

So in the end someone is gonna be paying a big bill to make this into a golf course for trout fishing. The stream already has a variety of character, even with the dam.

I am thinking if it's the landowner, the likelihood of leaving it open long term is dismal.

In addition, the YB gets tremendous flood flows the would require some very skilled design and construction personnel. Or it will all fall apart.

Should be interesting how this all plays out.

I predict the earliest ground break is next summer 2018 or winter 2019.

Personally I would leave the dam alone, maybe notch it a couple ft in a few places to extend the flow able water upstream and make the pool more wadable. (There are trout to be caught in there that feed all day on midges) and throw a rock and log deflectors on the banks upstream and downstream of the channel. Create a little sinuosity and deeper scour areas.

Whatever the case it's a big job with big dollar value and will have consequences...for profit businesses don't make six figure investments without an ROI, and the "free lunch croud" doesn't provide that.

 

[troutbert]

Maurice wrote:

Personally I would leave the dam alone, maybe notch it a couple ft in a few places to extend the flow able water upstream and make the pool more wadable.

I think this idea is a good one, not just for this location, but for some other similar situations.

But when I asked about this possibility, I was told that DEP would not allow it. That they would not give permits for notching or any other type of partial deconstruction of dams. That it was all or nothing.

Is this true? Do you know of cases where DEP has permitted notching?

I know of one case in PA where a landowner did something somewhat similar. But it wasn't notching. His dam had a built in water level control mechanism, which was just boards in concrete slots.

The sediment was built up to near the top of the dam, and there was a shallow muddy pond above the dam. He simply removed a couple of boards, draining the pond, and exposing the mudflat.

Which very quickly was colonized by vegetation, and acted very much like a normal floodplain, even though it of course an artificial floodplain, about 8 feet higher in elevation than the normal, original floodplain.

A nice meandering channel formed in the old flat, with a riffle-pool structure. And the large plunge pool was still there below the dam. And there was no massive release of sediment.

The results were very good. And the cost was...zero. He just pulled a few boards. Done!

 

[SteveG]

With how much money they're throwing around, I'd love to see their business plan and projections.

They can go right ahead and make a pellethead golf course. I'll sit back and watch the locals while they keep poaching the water lol