I hope this guy goes down!

[bikerfish]

http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2011/03/18/greene-county-man-accused-of-dumping-drilling-waste-water/

article says employees that were fired are disgruntled, they were probably fired because they knew what they were doing was wrong and questioned it.
the owner better have some good documentation on where that waste went.

 

[wildtrout24]

It really is sad what humanity will do for $$$$. Lets hope the punishment fits the crime

 

[franklin]

The investigation started two years ago under Attorney General Tom Corbett. Gee, I thought he didn't care at all about the environment and was in the pocket of the gas companies?

 

[jeff]

franklin wrote:
The investigation started two years ago under Attorney General Tom Corbett. Gee, I thought he didn't care at all about the environment and was in the pocket of the gas companies?

He doesn't care about the environment and he is in the gas companies pocket. Hell even his fellow republican lawmakers are crying foul over his budget proposal! They want a tax on drilling to help offset the deficit, but he'd rather slash funding education by 50%! Kudos to him for doing his job 2 yrs ago. I think it's about time he starts again! Or better yet throw the bum out and get a qualified person in office.

 

[franklin]

jeff wrote:

franklin wrote:
The investigation started two years ago under Attorney General Tom Corbett. Gee, I thought he didn't care at all about the environment and was in the pocket of the gas companies?

He doesn't care about the environment and he is in the gas companies pocket. Hell even his fellow republican lawmakers are crying foul over his budget proposal! They want a tax on drilling to help offset the deficit, but he'd rather slash funding education by 50%! Kudos to him for doing his job 2 yrs ago. I think it's about time he starts again! Or better yet throw the bum out and get a qualified person in office.

The budget does not cut funding for DCNR, in fact I believe there is a slight increase. He (Crobett) did not add any revenue for additional leases of state lands in spite of overturning the drilling ban that Rendell enacted. If he doesn't care at all about the environment why would he not slash the related budgets?

I've been doing some research on drilling taxes. Every state I checked so far that has a gas severance tax has a lower business tax rate. Some are significantly lower. If Pennsylvania implements a severance tax on gas the combined tax rates will be higher than any other state I have found so far. We would be significantly higher than some large gas producing states such as Texas. There is some merit in complaints from gas companies about doing business in Pennsylvania if a competitive severance tax is implemented.

 

[WildTigerTrout]

You sound like you work for the gas companies.

 

[jeff]

WildTigerTrout wrote:
You sound like you work for the gas companies.

WildTigerTrout

Some people just don't get it even after they are presented with fact after fact after fact. For Franklin to even suggest that Corbett gives a rat's a** about the environment is quite comical :lol:

 

[franklin]

jeff wrote:

WildTigerTrout wrote:
You sound like you work for the gas companies.

WildTigerTrout

Some people just don't get it even after they are presented with fact after fact after fact. For Franklin to even suggest that Corbett gives a rat's a** about the environment is quite comical :lol:

I just presented three facts that contradict your argument. Are you sure you are basing your analysis on facts or emotional conclusions?

 

[wildtrout24]

Does it still not come down to pumping millions of percious water into the ground and then pumping back out a toxic soup so to say and telling everyone its not bad for the environment. I just wish there was a better way is all i'm saying. Without clean water we are sh** outta luck..... trout or no trout.. If this guy is found guilty it goes shows that we can't rely on people being honest about the things they say or do. $$ talks

 

[franklin]

wildtrout24 wrote:
Does it still not come down to pumping millions of percious water into the ground and then pumping back out a toxic soup so to say and telling everyone its not bad for the environment. I just wish there was a better way is all i'm saying. Without clean water we are sh** outta luck..... trout or no trout.. If this guy is found guilty it goes shows that we can't rely on people being honest about the things they say or do. $$ talks

There are several threads on this site that show the math involved to demonstrate that during most times streams in PA can support the needed water with some simple management rules. As you can see in the article at the beginning of this thread there are consequences for dumping untreated water. There is some argument on the level of treatment needed for the waste water but even the water treated at plants with less than optimal treatment capability are 95% to where we should be. Objective, fact based arguments to politicians are going to be more effective than emotional responses.

 

[jeff]

Franklin again your quote research that implies that Corbett is concerned about environmental issues is laughable :lol: For Every issue you bring up claiming Corbett is for the environment I can bring up 10 that shows he isn't. To look at the 3 examples you provided.

His investigation into the dumping was his office. Not him personally! That is simply a function of what the attorney genrals office does. Besides it would be in his best interest to prosecute that nimwit as he has no tie to drillers other than getting rid of some of their untreated water. This nimwit's actions put the drilling industry under a bad light. Glad they did their job but I would hardly call that standing up for the environment

Cutting back funding to the DCNR would slow down drilling. If you don't know why then you have to do a little more research.

The only reason he overturned Rendell's ban on drilling in State Forests is cause he wants to start to issue permits again and will.

 

[JackM]

I am just wondering how much waste can be dumped while the AG investigates? Is there some reason it took so long to shut this guy down? This article suggests he's been at it for years:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11077/1132812-454.stm

 

[franklin]

JackM wrote:
I am just wondering how much waste can be dumped while the AG investigates? Is there some reason it took so long to shut this guy down? This article suggests he's been at it for years:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11077/1132812-454.stm

I think the investigation started with a whistle blower, one of his ex-employees. There was a fish kill in 2009 that may also have been what did him in. The press release states the offenses run from 2003 - 2009 implying he stopped (or changed methods that were not caught) about the time the investigation started.

 

[trout17]

Actually, many companies in the gas drilling and drilling water supply business are LLC's meaning they pay the same tax rate as you and I do. Corbett did slash the EPA budget 20% which is where the well inspections originate from and reported to.

The biggest issue with water withdrawal is that a large portion is then out of the water supply forever. Other industries use the water, it is then recycled either in a plant or naturally, and returned for use by all. The frac water stays underground or is injected underground forever. Or until it works it way up into the water table like in other areas of the country. And the gas drillers know this.

Jim Kearney

 

[franklin]

trout17 wrote:
Actually, many companies in the gas drilling and drilling water supply business are LLC's meaning they pay the same tax rate as you and I do. Corbett did slash the EPA budget 20% which is where the well inspections originate from and reported to.

The biggest issue with water withdrawal is that a large portion is then out of the water supply forever. Other industries use the water, it is then recycled either in a plant or naturally, and returned for use by all. The frac water stays underground or is injected underground forever. Or until it works it way up into the water table like in other areas of the country. And the gas drillers know this.

Jim Kearney

I checked, he cut DEP from 147 to 140 million or 5%. DCNR was increased.

I'm not aware of any fracking waste water being disposed of in PA in "deep holes". The water cannot be left in a producing well. It is placed in extra well holes drilled for the purpose in some states. In Pa most of it was disposed of after a given site was completed. Now some companies are starting to recycle to other sites.

Even if the water is lost it is a minuscule amount compared to the total water flowing in Pa streams. On a bad day Penns has over 150 million gallons flow by the gauge at the town of Penns Creek. On many days over a half billion gallons of water flows by. In the top 1 foot of water on Sayer Lake there is something like a 45 billion gallons of water. Enough to drill many thousands of wells.

 

[Missy]

I checked, he cut DEP from 147 to 140 million or 5%. DCNR was increased.

According to Penn Future, "Governor Corbett’s proposed FY 2011-2012 budget, unveiled this week, cuts DCNR’s General Fund appropriation by another whopping 30 percent."

and

"The state’s General Fund will now provide for less than one fifth of DCNR’s budget. And more than a third of DCNR’s entire operating budget - $95 million - now comes from resource extraction - drilling for gas and cutting timber."

 

[Maurice]

franklin wrote:

jeff wrote:

WildTigerTrout wrote:
You sound like you work for the gas companies.

WildTigerTrout

Some people just don't get it even after they are presented with fact after fact after fact. For Franklin to even suggest that Corbett gives a rat's a** about the environment is quite comical :lol:

I just presented three facts that contradict your argument. Are you sure you are basing your analysis on facts or emotional conclusions?

Range Resources sold 900 Million (with an M) of natural gas land assets in Texas and Louisiana to invest in PA Marcellus Gas play because as they put it....Its more lucrative and the government and environmental restrictions are easier to wade through.

The volume is pretty high on that one....

 

[Maurice]

franklin wrote:

trout17 wrote:
Actually, many companies in the gas drilling and drilling water supply business are LLC's meaning they pay the same tax rate as you and I do. Corbett did slash the EPA budget 20% which is where the well inspections originate from and reported to.

The biggest issue with water withdrawal is that a large portion is then out of the water supply forever. Other industries use the water, it is then recycled either in a plant or naturally, and returned for use by all. The frac water stays underground or is injected underground forever. Or until it works it way up into the water table like in other areas of the country. And the gas drillers know this.

Jim Kearney

I checked, he cut DEP from 147 to 140 million or 5%. DCNR was increased.

I'm not aware of any fracking waste water being disposed of in PA in "deep holes". The water cannot be left in a producing well. It is placed in extra well holes drilled for the purpose in some states. In Pa most of it was disposed of after a given site was completed. Now some companies are starting to recycle to other sites.

Even if the water is lost it is a minuscule amount compared to the total water flowing in Pa streams. On a bad day Penns has over 150 million gallons flow by the gauge at the town of Penns Creek. On many days over a half billion gallons of water flows by. In the top 1 foot of water on Sayer Lake there is something like a 45 billion gallons of water. Enough to drill many thousands of wells.

Of the frac water sent into the ground for drilling and fracking, about 20% comes back out laden with carcinogens, heavy metals and radiation. They are currently in some cases processing this through wastewater treatment plants that are not capable of cleaning this water and are not monitored for these chemicals upon discharge into receiving streams.

Furthermore, there are under 2,000 producing marcellus wells today and the number is expected to exceed 50,000 wells. How is that 25x factor going to be processed.
Coming to a wastewater treatment plant near you.

These municipal treatment plants are being offered lump sum payouts to process the water that is only sent through the latter stages of processing. At risk is the plant infrastructure and the receiving streams. Usually these are WWFs and have little protection. But keep in mind their NPDES permits do not cover these chemicals.

The local municipalities will be left holding the bag......And downstream drinking water intakes will also use this water for processing, further exacerbating the problems and cost to the local taxpayer.

 

[JackM]

Maurice wrote:
...because as they put it....Its more lucrative and the government and environmental restrictions are easier to wade through. ...

Hyman to Michael: "Finally, we have now what we have always needed: real partnership with the government...."

 

[troutbert]

I wonder what percentage of these illegal wastewater dumpers are caught? How much more of it goes on without them getting caught?