esox anonymous

[SteveG]

Well, after getting a musky follow right to my rod tip while fishing for smallies a few weeks ago, the inevitable happened. Earlier this week, while scouting a stretch of water before a fishing buddy's arrival, I had one on momentarily. I got two strips in, and the line went tight faster and started moving away unlike I've ever had while fishing for smallies. Then it gator rolled right at the top of the water, and what was left of my leader came sailing back at my face.

My opinion of people targeting musky prior to the past few weeks was more along the lines that I believed it was a novelty or something to brag about. But, now I find myself on the other side hahahaha. I keep replaying that moment in my head, wondering if I could've done anything differently (knowing full well I couldn't given that I was using 2x fluoro).

Anyway, I'm here for everyone to share your losses and wins, however subtle.

On a slightly more serious note, I do have two questions:
1. Due to the bouyancy of most of the flies I've seen, are floating lines even used, or is everyone using intermediate and full sink lines? I'll be casting potential new rod purchases soon, and thought it might be better to buy the line and reel first, so I can see how the rods are with that line as opposed to whichever floater the shop has.

2. Due to the size and bulk of the flies, what are some storage/box recommendations? I use the Cliff Bugger style boxes for my streamers now, but they aren't quite tall enough.

I'll see all of you at the next monthly meeting at the rec center.

 

[afishinado]

SteveG wrote:
Well, after getting a musky follow right to my rod tip while fishing for smallies a few weeks ago, the inevitable happened. Earlier this week, while scouting a stretch of water before a fishing buddy's arrival, I had one on momentarily. I got two strips in, and the line went tight faster and started moving away unlike I've ever had while fishing for smallies. Then it gator rolled right at the top of the water, and what was left of my leader came sailing back at my face.

My opinion of people targeting musky prior to the past few weeks was more along the lines that I believed it was a novelty or something to brag about. But, now I find myself on the other side hahahaha. I keep replaying that moment in my head, wondering if I could've done anything differently (knowing full well I couldn't given that I was using 2x fluoro).

Anyway, I'm here for everyone to share your losses and wins, however subtle.

On a slightly more serious note, I do have two questions:
1. Due to the bouyancy of most of the flies I've seen, are floating lines even used, or is everyone using intermediate and full sink lines? I'll be casting potential new rod purchases soon, and thought it might be better to buy the line and reel first, so I can see how the rods are with that line as opposed to whichever floater the shop has.

2. Due to the size and bulk of the flies, what are some storage/box recommendations? I use the Cliff Bugger style boxes for my streamers now, but they aren't quite tall enough.

I'll see all of you at the next monthly meeting at the rec center.

I really find it difficult to answer questions without knowing where and how you will be fishing. River or lake? From shore, wading or from a boat.

What rod are you looking to purchase? weight? action? Also, you may be better off matching up the rod reel and line since they all work together. Will you look to have an extra spool to switch over lines or want one line to do it all? Are you buying your rod just for musky, or are you looking to fish saltwater or for salmon?

In addition, test casting a line in the parking lot or grass may not be the same as trying to cast a huge wind resistant fly on the water.

The Cliff bugger beast will be able to hold your flies, but it's too big to wade with, it's great for boat fishing, though. The bugger beast junior can fit in my pack, but is still quite big.

 

[Wildbrowntrout]

As far as your first question, I have a 9wt fly rod with floating line that I use for musky. The flies do take a little time to get soaked so they sink properly, but I use a thin wire leader for them, which helps then sink. As for topwaters, they have no problem keeping on the surface with the wire leader, most them are either foam or deer hair. My storage box is just a plastic container. I have to make sure botnto leave it in the sun with a wet rabbit strip, because they will dry out. I'm doing this low budget, and only plan to fish when they are shallow.

 

[SteveG]

Afish, I'll be targeting stream fish wading. I'm keeping an open mind before deciding on a rod weight, but I'm leaning toward a 9 bc I won't throw anything gigantic. One rod I will be trying is the Sage Bass 2 Largemouth. It's popped up quite a bit during my research, as a rod that may suit my conditions well. I'll be test casting on water with appropriate flies for any testing.

 

[afishinado]

SteveG wrote:
Afish, I'll be targeting stream fish wading. I'm keeping an open mind before deciding on a rod weight, but I'm leaning toward a 9 bc I won't throw anything gigantic. One rod I will be trying is the Sage Bass 2 Largemouth. It's popped up quite a bit during my research, as a rod that may suit my conditions well. I'll be test casting on water with appropriate flies for any testing.

The Sage bass rod is designed for bass fishing (surprise!) in close to medium distances, so I would stay away from it for river musky fishing. Fredrick owns one and I've cast his. As advertised, it works for short to medium casts, but really does not cast a long line well at all. Fredrick is one of the best casters I know, and if he can't make that rod work, I don't know anyone else that can. Hopefully he'll see this thread and post some info.

The rod is short (7'11") and therefore shortens your casting stroke. Also the shorter rod keeps the line closer to the water on your back cast, a real problem, especially when wading. Also in the river currents you will need to mend line and a shorter rod is a handicap.

Just FYI, long casts are important when fishing for muskie. You need to cover a lot of water to find muskies, and present to the most amount of fish you can, since they are few and far between.

Also, since you are stripping in line, a long cast gives you more line to strip. If your casts are short, you will end up stripping in the line quickly and recasting way more than you really should be.

A long cast keeps the line in the water longer to up your odds. And you will find out that casting and recasting and casting and recasting all day is a lot of work. The fewer casts the better.

Finally, the rod is designed to be used with a specially tapered Sage bass line which is tapered for casting wind resistant flies short to medium distances. In addition the line is a floater, which something not really too useful for musky fishing.

I would recommend a 9' 10wt saltwater rod which has a fighting butt. If you like Sage, they offer good SW rods, as well, many of the other rod companies have some great rods to try.

As far as rod weight, there's nothing a 9wt can do that a 10wt won't, but the reverse is not true. The beefier 10wt will be better able to handle sinking lines and bigger flies.

As far as a reel for muskie...get a decent reel, but no need to get a top-of-the-line one like you would need for SW fishing. Muskies do not peel off a lot of line and most of the fighting is close in. Get a good rod that casts well for you and look to save some money when buying a reel.

If I had to choose one line for muskie fishing in the river, it would be an intermediate line. You can fish topwater flies with it, in fact some floating flies seem to bite into the surface better with a intermediate line. The line will get you down in the shallower parts of river, and you can use a poly leader looped on the end of your fly line to sink your flies deeper if needed. That's where the heavier 10wt comes into play; it will handle adding a sink tip when you need one, better than a lighter 9wt rod.

Good luck with your musky outfit...that beast is in there waiting for you!

 

[SteveG]

Ok, I was hoping the shorter rod would keep me under the overhanging branches, and there won't be much distance involved where I'll be most of the time.

I did get out with my 9' 6wt salt rod and a full sink line (don't remember the rate) rigged with an optic minnow last night. That fly has great action in the water, but takes a bit of time to get pulled to a good depth. I may need to experiment with some weighted or less bouyant patterns in the meantime. I will check out the 9 and 10wt version of my rod and see if they have the same characteristics, which I like.

 

[Dave_W]

SteveG wrote:
On a slightly more serious note, I do have two questions:
1. Due to the bouyancy of most of the flies I've seen, are floating lines even used, or is everyone using intermediate and full sink lines? I'll be casting potential new rod purchases soon, and thought it might be better to buy the line and reel first, so I can see how the rods are with that line as opposed to whichever floater the shop has.

2. Due to the size and bulk of the flies, what are some storage/box recommendations? I use the Cliff Bugger style boxes for my streamers now, but they aren't quite tall enough.

1. I'm firmly in the camp that thinks that if you are targeting muskies, you definitely want a sinking line. I like a fast sink shooting head but find that a basic sinking line does pretty good too. I rarely fish surface flies for muskies and you are right about the bouyancy of most muskie flies so a line that sinks fast really helps IMO.

2. Fly boxes are tricky if you are a wader. You can use any sort of big fly box or general tackle compartment box...the rub is how will you carry such a box when wading? Think about your vest/shoulder pack system and make sure that any box you select will fit in the pockets.
The other option - my preference - is to keep my flies in a big box with foam slots and pull three or four patterns out and move them to a smaller compartment box with long trays that fits into my vest pocket if I'm going to be wading. Finally, I keep a couple muskie flies with a length of flouro bite tippet rolled up in one particular pocket at all times. This way I always have a muskie fly available when I'm fishing for bass or trout as muskies tend to show up when you least expect them.

Good luck with your new muskie hunt!

 

[SteveG]

Dave, do you have a recommendation on the sinking head? Many of the lines I've been looking into didn't give any actual specs. I was using about 3' of 25lb fluoro last night, and the fly still seemed pretty high in the column. This was after waiting 4-5 seconds.

 

[sandfly]

I use a 7'6" redington special 9 wt for river and boat. also have a few 9' rods too

 

[Dave_W]

SteveG wrote:
Dave, do you have a recommendation on the sinking head? Many of the lines I've been looking into didn't give any actual specs. I was using about 3' of 25lb fluoro last night, and the fly still seemed pretty high in the column. This was after waiting 4-5 seconds.

The short leader usually helps sink the fly faster (as you know). I'd try a bit heavier flouro for a bite tippet, maybe 50lb, or a short length of wire.

I'm not sure of the weight of the head I have on my 10WT. I modify gear and this head was shortened, it is probably around 350 grains, I suppose.

I also tie my muskie flies with some weight at the front of the fly under the head and this helps sink it too. Incidentally, for fishing muskies in streams and rivers in summer, you don't always have to fish deep. A big fly fished with a very fast strip retrieve just under the surface is a good way to trigger fish. In the fall, however, you do want to get deeper and fish slower (at least this is the conventional wisdom).

 

[SteveG]

I will go heavier on the leader, it was an impromptu attempt and that was the heaviest I currently have. I'm looking forward to fall now.

 

[Fredrick]

Steve I own the original Sage Bass rod and love it for boat fishing . Because of the short length when wading the back cast hits the water allot .So it can be a pain to get some line out there when wadding. But when fishing off a boat you can really throw some line with it . If you do go with the Sage Bass rod I would go with the peacock version to throw musky flies. Also try looking at the toothy critter threads Toothy Critter.


http://www.sageflyfish.com/fly-rods/specialty/bass-ii/

 

[SteveG]

Thank you Frederick

 

[fly_flinger]

Fly storage- if wading, find something you could carry a few flies in like Dave suggested. I really don't think muskies are all that particular when it comes to flies. I recently spent 2 days fishing with Brad Bohen. Musky fishing is his life so he's in the know when it comes to fishing for them. He told me he will use the same fly for weeks on end because in his opinion, it's not the fly. If you find a fish that wants to eat, it'll eat any fly.
Leader- Like Dave said, you'll want a heavier bite guard. I would recommend at least 50lb fluoro.. Depending on where you are fishing(water depth) and the time of the year, having a break-point section in the leader is advisable. I use 20 lbs. maxima in case I get hung up and can't get the fly free. If no break point is used, you're gonna break your fly line as they are typically 20-30 lb rated. In the summer a nice swim might not be too bad but the fall and winter is a different story. It sucks losing a fly but gets worse if you need to buy a new line as well. My leader is 3'ish feet of maxima and 12-16" of 60lb bite guard.