caddis question

[flipnfly]

ok question time this weekend on elk creek the only one catching fish he and i got to bs'ing and i asked what he was getting them on and he showed me and told me it was a custom designed fly and also told me it was a caddis larva it was like at least a size 8 but i think it may have been a size 6 and it was tied with a gold bead head and golden brown ice dubbing by hareline i know because i use it now the question is in 2 parts here what caddis is that big and color and what caddis in that area is still int he water or are they in the water all the time? ok so thats like 4 parts but a lil help would be greatly appriceated

 

[troutbert]

That sounds a lot like the Beadhead Walts Worm, which is just a bead (I like gold or copper) and shaggy Hare's ear fur, with gold wire rib, if you like.

It's just a killer fly, in all sizes, especially when the water is slightly murky. It's a general, suggestive type of pattern, not a specific imitation.

 

[RLeep2]

Although it is all but impossible to know what goes on in the mind of a fish, if this is the steelhead Elk Creek being discussed here, I'm not sure if what caddis species are in the watershed matters much if at all in terms of what fish will or will not take.

It was never my experience that these fish were wired that way and while from a chemistry standpoint, Elk Creek is pretty fertile, I don't think the substrate is very amenable to good concentrations of any of the regular aquatic insects (although I've seen decent numbers of olives there now and again.

All this to say that is probably more likely the guy fishing the "caddis larvae" was successful more because he was showing the fish something they had not seen before or had the right drift figured out than anything to do with the steelhead actually recognizing the fly as a caddis larvae and responding to that.

That would be my view anyway...

 

[jaybo41]

I'd have to agree with RLeep's assessment. Very well put. Especially in Erie you'll get takes on something that the fish haven't seen, changing colors of patterns already in your box can be the ticket.

Another thought came to mind which was from a recent article that I read in Fly Fisherman magazine. Much like Walt's Worm, GRHE, and PT Nymphs, some flys can mimmic other patterns. Perhaps this is the case here, in addition to the fact that it was something the fish hadn't been seeing on a regular basis.

Here's the link.

 

[osprey]

On DGC's avatar pic is what i believe to be an adult cinnamon sedge , i would have to say that the larva and pupae stage of that insect is what that type of fly imitates , that's my story and i'm stickin to it.

 

[Millertime]

Flip,
It was the old timer the next hole up from where you were when we saw on the creek. Had an orange hat on. I scooped and scored on that. I asked him if we would leave a couple fish in the creek for everyone else to catch and i managed to stick around while he was casting and he had that little greenish bead head larve on I am glad you got the details. . . that guy was top catcher of the day that I saw.

In those low clear conditions apparently that works well.

I picked up a fish on a maggot cluster last weekend thanks to Bowman (dave) I tied up a bunch of those white ultra chennile and burn the tips. done. Something I probably wouldnt have tied on any sooner than late afternoon on a fishless day with nothing else to use.

 

[Millertime]

Green Larvae


These look really awesome:

Cool Tie

 

[Maurice]

My steelhead box is full of odd flies that made entire trips successful on the Eire tribs. Often times when nothing else is working, I will try these previous MVP's only to change out again and again until a new Rookie of the year emerges.

Much of what was said above is accurate, strange flys work remarkably well sometimes and often times, the pattern used is a gargantuan version of a traditional wet fly or nymph. Don't go getting all romantic about steelhead fishing and aquatic entomology. Those fish are mind-bent in a gauntlet of fishing lines and curved steel pointy things, Once they get past the first mile, If they have not been hooked, they are easy to catch. If they have been hooked, you are playing a game of odds with the hope that what you are drifting past them at the moment they get a mental twitch between paranoid to hunger they think is food. If the water color is clearing and receeding they are less paranoid and more likely to eat something. Considering that the Erie tribs are not piscatoral cafeterias the everpresent conveyor belt of terminal tackle varieties demonstrates more of a resemblence to Las Vegas odds than is does to tuning into a fishes tastes in local cuisine.

 

[boss_steb]

As far as Caddis...I have a ton of success on a cream caddis with some flash in it...size 14 with a gold bead and little brown head...Jerry Darkes calls them Elk Creek Caddis...I started turning over rocks the last time I was there and found quite a bit of little cream/light gray colored caddis there. I have also had good luck with a green caddis like the ones millertime has pictured...they are there all year long...

I also started tying the green caddis with holographic tinsel down the back...I don't know if it was a fluke but the first cast I tried last month...I fish nailed it...got her to the shore where she broke off with my fly...only one I had tied...I have since tied a bunch more...I will let you know if it was just one crazy fish or if I am on to something....

Boss

 

[Millertime]

Good call on the on the "flash back" I was looking at some wide holographic Christmas tree garland at lowes (while the wife was putting me into holiday debt...)

And I started thinking to myself hmmmmm that garland would tie about 18 million larvae/ scud backs. haha.

Our Christmas tree will just look a little less dressed up each year as I thin out the garland. hahaha.

 

[ryguyfi]

I use easter grass as some flashback. It works pretty well. I also tie it on the sides of some of my buggers and then wrap the hackle over top of it.

I tied up a few of the caddis in the 2nd link that MillerTime showed a while ago. They look really good. I used both white and green for the bodies. It just amazes me how real they look compared to the natural. Only caught a smallie on it so far. Not too hard of a tie either. I planned to use them in Erie, but never got to them as I was catching fish with other things.

 

[flipnfly]

btw boss i lost the slumpbuster in a steel head battle on 16 mile good tie im going to have to try to duplicate that one as far as the sharks caddis miller i have tied a few up i tied big ones but definatly am going to tie more of that style all sz 8 though lol i tied them in cream olive abd i also tied a czech style phesant tail type hybrid antron body phesant tail fibers for the tail it pretty neat lookin imma have to order hooks this week as i am totaly out and all i have are sz 8 lol bogger hooks anf big wetfly hooks now to pry myself away from modern warfare 2
thanks to all the advice everyone

 

[boss_steb]

I tie that on just a 3x Long heavy nymph hook...Not sure if anyone has seen the video by Kelly Galloup on streaming fishing for big trout...like in the 25-30 in range...he ties most of his flied on short shank hooks...like clousers...says big fish hit the head to swallow it...makes sense...

Fly, which color pattern did you have...I tied about 4 or 5 different color patterns...

Glad to hear it worked for someone...

Boss

 

[jayL]

Slumpbusters are my go to streamer.

I tried yours in NY boss. I didnt catch anything on any of my flies that day, unfortunately.

 

[osprey]

BOSS........TAKE THOSE 14 CADDIS WITH YOU TO PERRY CO. AND NEVER HESITATE TO DO THE TWITCH.

 

[sandfly]

sounds like the october caddis or its cousin the spotted caddis, Its in there all yaer. Hatches during the fall. Generally its a dirty cream color until it pupates then it gets an orange color to it, hence the golden brown dubbing.

 

[boss_steb]

will do Osprey...

what the heck...maybe I will head way up into the Juniata County and check some of that water...

Boss

 

[flipnfly]

it was olive with a green holographic body gold cone copper wire if i remember correctly

 

[osprey]

Boss......there is some great native brookie fishing in Juniata co near the town of Honey Grove was a nice one , can't remember the name. Also there is a "laurel run" in the state gamelands up there that is nice. Hope you have a blast.