Allegheny tailwater recommendations?

[KeviR]

I am thinking about trying the Allegheny below Kinzua on Memorial Day weekend. (I have a drift raft.)
From the things I have read about it, it seems that it's decent fishing. (trout is what I'm after). But there's not a whole lot of info about it.
It seems like it's more a quality fishery than a quantity fishery. That's OK.
I also gather that floating is the better way to access the river, so that's good too.
Anybody willing to provide some pointers for that stretch at that time? (Hatches, productive areas, etc.)
And there seem to be lots of access for boat launching, but which stretches are preferable? How far downstream will the trout fishing hold up at that time of year, typically? What areas are good to focus on? (are there things that might not be obvious that are worth knowing?)
On a separate, but related topic, many many moons ago I read about a brown drake on the Tionesta. (I think in a PA guide book, not sure which one.) Is the Tionesta worth trying even if the Allegheny is fishing well? I read something that said that fishable hatches on the Tionesta are not that common. True? Any I am fine with nymph fishing anyway, so a fishable hatch is not a hard requirement, just curious. I've never seen a solid brown drake hatch, so if there's a decent chance to see one, that's probably worth a side trip.
A PM is fine if you don't want to broadcast hard-earned info.
Thanks for any feedback. Even if you tell me that it's lousy and I should really go somewhere else!

 

[Solitariolupo]

Below the dam is some great fishing. As for your boat you can’t go all the way to the dam there are signs pretty much right at the boat ramp stopping you from going up. Also I wouldn’t do it in a drift boat as the current can get pretty strong right there. So if you go that route you can only drift down which you can get into some schools of trout but the closer to the dam area the better.
Fishing on the hatchery side is better for trout I hear.

As for flies I hear big streamers, crayfish, minn patterns.

As for tionesta it is stocked and smaller water then the Allegheny river so I would think the trout will be easier to get. There are flies on all creeks just gotta find one that works. You may be able to drift the creek in your boat. Depends on how big your boat is.

 

[timbow]

Trout fishing gets pretty spotty once you get downstream of the warren bridge. Your only real option for launching is to put in at the dam. Take-out you have a few options, none are real good. If you are an Eagles club member you can use their take-out right above the warren bridge. It’s a steep bank and you will need to have help getting the boat up the bank. Next downstream option is the helipad at warren hospital. Not an official ramp but as long as you are quick nobody will say anything. Downstream of that is Betts park. Good take-out but it is a long push through deadwater to get there.

 

[jrcll]

the water below the dam is good , the first island is dixon island and if the flows are below 2000cfm you can access it from hemlock rd, .... its a nine mile float from the dam down to Warren, there is an access point up from the hospital , its on the right just up from Alleghany outfitters [ which is an awesome store with good info on floating ]... also also there`s an outdoor store a block up from Allegheny outfitters called Penn wild outdoors....opened by a local guy a couple of years ago , they are usually sitting at the vise tying flies.... great fishing info, i know they have a facebook page also

 

[D-nymph]

Just FYi - If you choose to use the Warren Hospital helipad for launching or taking out, please - be prepared & hustle. That helipad is used for life flight situations, it is used more often than you'd think & medical helicopters probably aren't cool with floaters having their stuff all spread out on the helipad while they are trying to save people's lives. I've seen plenty of boat ramps where guys spread their stuff all over the place, don't do that here. I've been there before when we pulled our boat out of the water & up onto the road to tie everything down then 2 minutes after getting our boat on the trailer & up into the driveway a helicopter landed, with no warning. If we had loafed around that day at all or been unorganized with our gear, we would have been preventing that heli from getting to its patient.

 

[KeviR]

Wow, all good feedback. I will put in a plug here for small inflatable (frame) fishing rafts. I have a smaller one that is for 2 people, but it weights only about 60-70 pounds with the frame, so it's easy to put in or take out in places you could never get a conventional driftboat. Basically if you can scramble up or down a bank, you can put in or take out the raft. So it I think that even some of the sketchy options for access could work.
As an extreme example of unconventional river access, I have seen videos of guys dropping one of these boats into a river off a high bridge. But it rows like a conventional driftboat and has the same kind of anchor system. It's not self-bailing so it's not for major whitewater, but the flipside of that is that it drafts very shallow. The one beef I have with it is that there is no stansion for the passenger in the front. So you can't really stand up while moving. (At least I don't dare to.)

One other little anecdote I will relate about the access advantage is from a float on the upper Delaware. We were getting out at the end of the day at Buckingham and there were 15-20 drift boats lined up waiting to use the ramp. It was at least an hour until the last one was in. We pulled up on the bank about 50 yards above the ramp and walked the raft up to the truck in the parking lot while the driftboat folks exchanged testy words about others needing to wait their turn. We grilled dinner on the tailgate and set up our camp chairs to watch the parade of trucks, trailers and boats.

 

[KeviR]

D-nymph - your point is well taken about being considerate and mindful is that kind of situation.

 

[dryflyguy]

Wow, all good feedback. I will put in a plug here for small inflatable (frame) fishing rafts. I have a smaller one that is for 2 people, but it weights only about 60-70 pounds with the frame, so it's easy to put in or take out in places you could never get a conventional driftboat. Basically if you can scramble up or down a bank, you can put in or take out the raft. So it I think that even some of the sketchy options for access could work.
As an extreme example of unconventional river access, I have seen videos of guys dropping one of these boats into a river off a high bridge. But it rows like a conventional driftboat and has the same kind of anchor system. It's not self-bailing so it's not for major whitewater, but the flipside of that is that it drafts very shallow. The one beef I have with it is that there is no stansion for the passenger in the front. So you can't really stand up while moving. (At least I don't dare to.)

One other little anecdote I will relate about the access advantage is from a float on the upper Delaware. We were getting out at the end of the day at Buckingham and there were 15-20 drift boats lined up waiting to use the ramp. It was at least an hour until the last one was in. We pulled up on the bank about 50 yards above the ramp and walked the raft up to the truck in the parking lot while the driftboat folks exchanged testy words about others needing to wait their turn. We grilled dinner on the tailgate and set up our camp chairs to watch the parade of trucks, trailers and boats.

I had a similar experience at Buckingham access on the Delaware too.

Was floating with a buddy in a 2 man kayak.
As we approached the access, at least a dozen drift boats were backed up waiting.
We glided past them and put in on the bank above the ramp.
As we did so, a guy in one of the boats took offense, and really started to give it to us.
I started yelling right back at him, and really got him ticked off I guess.
He was still screaming at us as we carried the kayak up the hill to the truck.
If I had still been there when he finally got in, I probably would have been in a fist fight

 

[D-nymph]

D-nymph - your point is well taken about being considerate and mindful is that kind of situation.

Thanks. It's the only takeout for boats on trailers. If people were to act like they do on a lot of other ramps, losing access to this one would big time suck. Enjoy.

With your rig, taking out at the outfitter's place in Warren, is probably a snap. With mine, not so much.

 

[Solitariolupo]

When I use my yak on the Allegheny there’s places I don’t want to float a couple hrs to get to so I park and just go over the hillside with it. Paddle around and right back up the hillside. Can’t do that with my boat.

Just gotta watch doing it in some places as your not allowed to do that. It is in the rules you gotta used the public launches. Especially around state parks.

 

[timbow]

Wow, all good feedback. I will put in a plug here for small inflatable (frame) fishing rafts. I have a smaller one that is for 2 people, but it weights only about 60-70 pounds with the frame, so it's easy to put in or take out in places you could never get a conventional driftboat. Basically if you can scramble up or down a bank, you can put in or take out the raft. So it I think that even some of the sketchy options for access could work.
As an extreme example of unconventional river access, I have seen videos of guys dropping one of these boats into a river off a high bridge. But it rows like a conventional driftboat and has the same kind of anchor system. It's not self-bailing so it's not for major whitewater, but the flipside of that is that it drafts very shallow. The one beef I have with it is that there is no stansion for the passenger in the front. So you can't really stand up while moving. (At least I don't dare to.)

One other little anecdote I will relate about the access advantage is from a float on the upper Delaware. We were getting out at the end of the day at Buckingham and there were 15-20 drift boats lined up waiting to use the ramp. It was at least an hour until the last one was in. We pulled up on the bank about 50 yards above the ramp and walked the raft up to the truck in the parking lot while the driftboat folks exchanged testy words about others needing to wait their turn. We grilled dinner on the tailgate and set up our camp chairs to watch the parade of trucks, trailers and boats.

Just be aware that that just about the entire stretch from the dam to warren is private property. The Hemlock rd side is all houses and cabins. The kinzua rd side is pretty steep bank, even for a 60lb raft

 

[Bruno]

Regarding Tionestia creek, last year I fished an amazing Brown Drake hatch the week of Memorial Day. I had the place all to myself. There are also some good caddis hatches as well. Bonus - there are Green Drakes on streams in the area. Access is easy all along the crick with put ins and take out easily found. Additionally if you hit Tionestia you can go to one of the greatest roadhouse bars in the world . The Clarion is another bug factory in the area that is easily floated.

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[pcray1231]

Wow, a callout of Cougar Bob's!!! Woohoo. Bruno, my camp is a couple miles from there. Great place with lots of memories....

 

[tomgamber]

I think I lunched there once when I was in college at Clarion. Havent been to Tionesta since the tornados.

 

[pcray1231]

Wow, all good feedback. I will put in a plug here for small inflatable (frame) fishing rafts. I have a smaller one that is for 2 people, but it weights only about 60-70 pounds with the frame, so it's easy to put in or take out in places you could never get a conventional driftboat. Basically if you can scramble up or down a bank, you can put in or take out the raft.

No doubt on advantages over a drift boat, but can I ask what the advantage is of this over a kayak? Because you can take 2 people and have a rower and a fisher I assume? Kind of the tweener between a 1 person fishing kayak and a drift boat?

I am running a 1 person, sit on top kayak (Jackson Coosa). About same weight, I think it's 62 lbs before you add the seat. I can stand and fish on it. I can cartop it myself and get it to and from water without help. I have an anchor system running. It drafts shallow and rams rocks without damage just fine. It can handle moderate whitewater. Last summer was my first with it. I mostly pleasure boated and did a little spinning rod/smallmouth fishing with it, but intend to do more trouty stuff this year. Only worry about doing Little J/Penns type trips is having to dodge 1000 wading fishermen without being an ****** to them, but that's the case in any watercraft.

But yeah, having to row and fish at the same time is tricky. Can be done in slower sections for a quick few casts, but if you intend to really settle down and fish, you gotta anchor or else get out and wade.

 

[dano]

For that weekend you'll most likely see a lots of tan caddis. Early morning hatch. Evening egg layers.
You also might see the start of the brown drakes if we get an early spring. The spinner fall fishes far better than the hatch. The drake population is more abundant downstream below Dixon.